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Vulpex Posts: 390
5/19/2017
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The artifacts on the moon are valuable and as such will need to be defended.
At the very least those companies entrusted with the managing of a research center should also contribute to the defense of the moon. The level of contribution would need to be determined and it is likely to evolve with time.
There is also the question as to whether further support troops may be stationed on the moon and in which conditions this should happen.
Please express your views below on how you see the establishment of moon defenses.
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RadCavalier Posts: 24
5/19/2017
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I believe the only equitable means to establish defenses on the moon is a pre-determined list of fortifications and defenses supplied to those three organizations which have, up until now, so hotly contested lunar real estate. The Mining Guild, Ark, and Dogstar would each enforce this list of fortifications/units ensuring that each organization's defense does not exceed the others, and any two can exist without the third to prevent vulnerability to perfidy.
Independent organizations wishing to contribute to the defense of the site would be welcome under these terms only so long as they remain independent.
Thoughts?
-Mathias Shaw
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/19/2017
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I'm pushing municipal model where the corp responsible for the defense of the moon is not allowed to conduct research at the same time. See the research thread and consider it.
An advantage there is that it's very easy to review in the view screen an see that everything is as it should be. Look at the deffensive structures, they are all owned by the mayor of Lewis, check. Look at the the structure named New York, is it owned by the mayor of New York? No, but there was an election just a few turns ago so lets see if they have offered a contract to the new mayor Or wait to see if te new mayor complains to the Lewis city manager. There are two operating research stations named Rabat! I need to bring this to the city manager's attention right away so he can burn one down!
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ChaChaCharms Posts: 167
5/19/2017
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So the Person who defends the moon for everyone doesn't get to research and has to foot the bill for all the defense?
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Never trust anything that can think for itself if you can’t see where it keeps its brain..
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/19/2017
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Well, you won't even be up for office if you didn't spend the week before researching. It means no one will be jockeying for that position of power to get a foot hold for a coup.
Actually, I just realized the flaw in that plan as I imagined it. I forgot that you cant get elected unless you have your HQ there already, and you would be giving up your office on Earth to move it.
I think it would be preferable to have to have a separation between custodian and beneficiary, but maybe then we can't find anybody reliable willing to put their HQ up there.
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/19/2017
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And if someone has their HQ up there just out of altruism they will want to put their industry up there to get the HQ bonuses, which means they may end up with more votes than all the research bases combined and that takes away from making them answerable to earth bound mayors.
I guess you have to give the city manager a research station to make the job worth having. Maybe even give them an extra share to make it worth not having your other industry in the same city as your HQ.
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/19/2017
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Or, rather than giving them an extra share of the research just accept that the job will be more attractive to someone whose bussiness is primarily in harvesting raw material because they have their industry spread out all over the place to begin with.
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jimbobdaz Posts: 83
5/20/2017
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Hi Hutton, i`ve just read this after moving my HQ to the moon  ...sorry i should read through these negotiations earlier, i was there before the wipe and was hoping to get back... hope this doesn`t mess things up
edited by jimbobdaz on 5/20/2017
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/20/2017
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Someone had to throw their hat into the ring. Someone with enough cash to buy The OBSIDIAN monuments for their default price.
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jimbobdaz Posts: 83
5/20/2017
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I`m not buying the "monuments" don`t have anywhere near enough cash atm... main reason for moving has always been the slight bonus to research for having HQ on site, i`m more interested in growing Lewis which will mean mainly geoboosters being produced
edited by jimbobdaz on 5/20/2017
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FuriousGeorge Posts: 51
5/20/2017
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I see the Defense as a certification and payment for your research time.
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jimbobdaz Posts: 83
5/20/2017
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It could work so all defences are transferred to the ruler of Lewis as it is their responsibility to grow and defend the city, if/when ruler is elected out, moves or quits then said defences should be transferred to the new ruler
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Vulpex Posts: 390
5/21/2017
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This subject still clearly needs further discussion.
It will be further developed.
My personal take - all lawful holders of Research Facilities in the moon should be jointly responsible for the defence of the moon. I would not be comfortable leaving the defence of the moon to a single corporation not only because that gives a lot of power to a single person but also because a single corp will struggle to raise the military might to stop a concerted attack on the moon.
Further discussion needed - lets hear what you all think.
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/21/2017
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My previous suggestion was that each stakeholder should be allowed to station one unit of whatever type and level they choose, except commandos. That should be enough to oust the city manager if they violate the charter.
The city manager hold defensive structures plus one ground unit of each type. I had initially thought that there should be no industry other that research allowed on the Lewis to prevent anyone from getting undue influence on the election of the city manager. But that deprives the city manager of use of his HQ bonus. It also means Lewis would have ever increasing infrastructure demand, so I propose that the city manage gets a monopoly on infrastructure on the moon while they hold office. That should make the job profitable enough to be desirable. It will also provide an incumbent advantage, but not one that's insumaountable if we put the same level caps on infrastructure structures.
There should perhaps be a convention against carriers of fleets entering moon space without clearance from the Lewis City Manager. No reason anyone else should need more than one ship there at a time unless a city manager needs to be forcably removed.
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Zip555 Posts: 67
5/22/2017
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Everyone doing research should be required to have some defenses, proportional to their research.
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John Posts: 67
5/22/2017
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Seems fair, and best of all, you can just sell all your defenses to the next govenor if need be. (Though it could mean each replacement would need many millions on hand to actually transfer the moon rights. But that totally works.
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Walk the true path, or be trampled beneath it.
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/22/2017
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I think it is important that stake holders have limited defenses and need to depend on the City Manager, and here's why: I suspect the CityManager will have to burn down research facilities on a fairly routine basis. Not necessarily because a corp is actively defying a charter. Real life issues may pull city rulers away from the game. The more entrenched everyone is by themselves the harder and more expensive it is going to be for the City Manager to dig them out by themselves. I prefer a situation where the city manager doesn't have to rally everyone together to address a routine issue. For the same reason I think there should be a convention against standing orders to defend anything other than your own Corporation on the moon.
On the flip side, an issue where the City Manager has to be forcibly removed should be a fairly momentous decision that requires most of the stakeholders to unite and coordinate an attack. Maybe we should say it is the Emperor's responsibility/prerogative to recognize when a CIty Manager is breaking the charter and coordinate an attack, either opeenly or through private messages with the stakeholders.
The City Manager should be obliged to always have all of his units, except maybe commandos, to always be protecting the area. Attacks from AI threats will be attacking the area anyway so you will get the benefit of the City Manager's defensive structures.
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Hutton Posts: 276
5/22/2017
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It looks like Jimbobdaz is the one most actively pursueing the City Manager job, so I'd like to hear his take on the above as the corp that is probably going to be administering the charter.
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jimbobdaz Posts: 83
5/22/2017
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The city manager hold defensive structures plus one ground unit of each type. I had initially thought that there should be no industry other that research allowed on the Lewis to prevent anyone from getting undue influence on the election of the city manager. But that deprives the city manager of use of his HQ bonus. It also means Lewis would have ever increasing infrastructure demand, so I propose that the city manage gets a monopoly on infrastructure on the moon while they hold office. That should make the job profitable enough to be desirable. It will also provide an incumbent advantage, but not one that's insumaountable if we put the same level caps on infrastructure structures.
Agreed... not sure about the one of each ground unit though
There should perhaps be a convention against carriers of fleets entering moon space without clearance from the Lewis City Manager. No reason anyone else should need more than one ship there at a time unless a city manager needs to be forcably removed.
Agreed
I think there should be a convention against standing orders to defend anything other than your own Corporation on the moon. wrote:
Agreed
The City Manager should be obliged to always have all of his units, except maybe commandos, to always be protecting the area. Attacks from AI threats will be attacking the area anyway so you will get the benefit of the City Manager's defensive structures.
Agreed
edited by jimbobdaz on 5/22/2017
edited by jimbobdaz on 5/22/2017
edited by jimbobdaz on 5/22/2017
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